Stickman Readers' Submissions August 8th, 2005

What Farangs Don’t Get About Thai Women 2

What Farangs “Don’t Get” About Thai Women Follow Up

By Jayson

I have taken the unusual step of inserting some clarifications to some misrepresentations the author has made with this story

This title scheme has probably outlived its usefulness, but I’ll tap it one last time. Looks like I touched a nerve with a couple of folks. It’s like I peed in their breakfast cereal…or at least threatened their manhood. There’s
the Thai Wanderer guy who didn’t leave his name, so we’ll call him the Coconut Farang. And the other guy, who did leave a name (BKK Bruce), but he’s pretty pissed, so we’ll call him the Angry White Man (AWM). In case
you missed it, let me summarize what they said as they both said about the same things: “Thais aren’t as smart as me, are more racist than me, can’t have an intelligent thought, treat their women badly, and all their women
are whores.

Thai Wanderer did not say this. He actually said the opposite. What he actually said was:

“many foreigners think:

mens clinic bangkok

(1) All Thais are poor

(2) All Thai women are gold diggers, prostitutes or out to catch a rich foreigner

Oh, and just so you don’t think it’s sour grapes, I’m also a great guy that women would go ga-ga over. All Thai chicks dig me, even the non-bar girls. And they all want to sleep with me. But they’re all still whores. Thai people
suck and Thailand sucks.”

(Thai Wanderer did not say this. He actually said: “…while there are many things I like about Thai culture, there are many I don’t….
”; and “I have some fantastic memories of Thailand (and some bad ones too)”

I think that about covers it. What especially astonishes me is their remarkable ability to read minds, i.e., know what Thai folks are thinking, why they’re thinking it, and what they’ll be thinking of next, all this while being functionally illiterate in the language and culture. (Thai Wanderer actually spent 10 months learning Thai at Chula university if you read Readers submission 377 “To Speak or not to Speak”) Maybe I can have one of my Japanese associates go to the US, hang out with hookers for a couple of years, never learn English, and come back and tell me exactly how Americans think. But through all their rhetoric and self-serving bravado, they never even bothered to try and answer the question of “why farang men seem to frequently find the worst of Thailand when it comes to Thai women?” That, after all, was the whole point of the earlier post I wrote. Wait a minute, maybe they did? It was the Thai women’s fault. And they’re all whores.

I think most farangs understand my point, which is not to be condescending, but rather to give another perspective. A Thai perspective. The biggest problem that I see with some farangs coming to Thailand is “unrealistic expectations,” whether it be with women or business. What happens then is when things aren’t as they want them to be or think they should be, they become bitter, spiteful, and hateful and blame everyone else for their problems but themselves. For example, it’s normal for a guy to feel crappy when he gets rejected by a woman, but it may be worse for a farang in Thailand because he comes here thinking all Thai women are supposed to worship him. That’s where you need to be a little more realistic and realize that you may have to work just as hard as back home, if not harder, to win the affections of a good Thai woman. The women that just give themselves to you…well I’d say proceed with extreme caution. Otherwise you just end up as roadkill like so many of Stick’s letter writers (hence my previous effort to draw attention to the possible cause). As I said before, I love it when I talk to a farang or read something from a farang who really gets it. What’s there to get? That deep down, beyond the language and the culture thing, Thai people are really just like everyone else. They’re playing the hand that was dealt them in the best way they can. They work and they care for their families. They trust and distrust. They have pride in their people and their culture. They don’t like air pollution, discourteous drivers, or dishonest people. There are bad apples, but certainly a lot more good, honest, decent, thoughtful folks (kind of like the farang side of the house). They will respect you if you earn it. And they really want to get along with farangs. Most farangs that come over are going to do just fine because they respect the people and the culture. But some farangs get into trouble because they believe that coming over with a wad of money and a my-shit-don’t-stink sort of attitude means that every Thai is supposed to bow to them and every women is supposed to want to carry their child. Really doesn’t happen that way, does it?

I read my previous post over again and still believe that I was rather matter-of-fact about the whole thing. If anything, I owe an apology to the “Isaan” women of Thailand for allowing these pretentious farang guys to latch on to something that they can claim moral superiority, even if they don’t practice it in real life. I actually like women with a little color, and it’s not the one determining factor that makes a woman good or bad. And Thais don’t exactly discriminate against dark skin folks—I wouldn’t call it that. It’s more like a society’s vision of feminine beauty. You all should understand…every society has it. But before I get into that, I thought it rather comical that these tools (read CF and AWM) would be lecturing anyone about prejudice or judging someone based on their skin color. Their overall attitude smacks of racism in the extreme. Moreover, it’s almost like they’re implying that this sort of thing would NEVER happen in Farangland. Excuse me? Farangs perfected the art of judging someone based on their skin color. America and the west have been engaged in some of the most evil sort of racism mankind had ever seen. Talk to most African-Americans and Hispanic-Americans and they’ll tell you that racism still exists today in America. I’d mention the Native Americans too, but there’s not too many of those folks left. What’s happening in Thailand is nothing like that.

wonderland clinic

You may notice that there are a whole lot of dark skinned folks in Thailand. Some of them are actually running the country, albeit mostly men. Which is why I brought up the obese American women thing up before as a point of reference because there is a stark similarity in a lot of ways between them and dark skinned Thai women. Men can get away with being overweight in America, much more so than women. Same with the dark skin thing. There’s really nothing sinister happening here. People are not being refused employment or apartments because of skin color. Are you kidding me? It’s a taste thing and it’s very much like how men look at obese women in the west. America has what I would call their society’s vision of feminine beauty. You know what it is. It’s the Jessica Alba’s, Charlize Theron’s, Anna Kournikova’s, even the Halle Berry’s. Not a whole lot of big women on this list. I’d venture to say that America discriminates against fat women. Well not in the same way as the cowardly sort of racism they practiced against blacks. But it’s there. So much so that teenage girls starve themselves to become what they believe society wants them to become. A shame, but if you’re a young American man, you’re most likely going to grow up with the perception that thin women are not only attractive on the outside, but also more attractive on the inside. That’s not right is it, judging people on appearance alone? Especially because it’s been apparent for some time that obesity is not a lifestyle choice for most but hereditary…sort of like skin pigment.

Well Thailand is no different. They have a vision of feminine beauty as well, and some of it has to do with skin color. It’s evolved over the years, and yes, it had to do more with people being laborers and being out in the field. As opposed to American racism, which was more about genetic superiority and all that nonsense. But Thailand treats her dark skinned women much better than America treats her obese women. If there’s a Thai Jay Leno telling dark skin women jokes, it’s going to be because he’s a dark skin guy himself. But this is amongst Thais and between Thais. It’s almost like how black folks in America can call each other the “N” word while whites can’t. (or don’t you understand why that is?) A mother will tell her daughter to stay out of the sun, but there’s never going to ever be an editorial in the Thai papers that says dark people are inherently bad. Thai folks aren’t like that. Point here is that Coconut Farang and AWM believes it’s ok for America and the west to judge women on appearance, but if Thais do it, it’s just oh-so-God awful.
(Actually Thai Wanderer made no comment whatsoever about America. If you do a word search, in over 5,000 words, the word “America” is never used once in his submission) And that’s pretty consistent with their attitude towards anything a Thai person does because they’ll never have anything positive to say. Oh they might bring up very specific isolated instances about certain Thais, but only to point out how these very few Thais are the exception to the rule–a typical racist tactic. Prime examples of guys with “unrealistic expectations” who couldn’t make it here but think that sending over petty insults will somehow “get back at those uppity Thais who didn’t see things the way they did” and at the same time, make them feel better about themselves. Don’t know about the latter, but I don’t think any Thais are losing sleep over their racist diatribe.

Now Coconut Farang and AWM also believes that “all Thai women are gold diggers, prostitutes or out to catch a rich foreigner.” They believe that Thailand is just overflowing with Thai hookers.
(Again Thai Wanderer actually said the opposite , that it is “misplaced”, i.e wrong to say that.)I believe just the opposite. In fact, I’m amazed there aren’t more prostitutes in Thailand. Consider that the economy in Thailand is still in a bad way. Very few opportunities out there. Not many good paying jobs. Yet, most Thai women– and we’re talking in the 99 percentile–would still rather work 10 hours a day, 6 days a week, for pennies, than sell themselves to foreigners for twenty times the money. God bless them. All gold-diggers, eh? Well I see Thai women of every shade with just your average-every-day Thai guy every single day, and they seem pretty happy to me. I don’t think these guys are carrying a whole lot of net worth. I often wonder what western women would do if faced with the same dire economic conditions, where there was an easier way to make money with rich foreigners. Would be a heck of a lot more farang hookers.

It also fascinates me how guys like coconut farang and AWM could always manage to find themselves around hookers while in Thailand. I read one of Stick’s letters from a couple of months back where an angry Thai woman said that she didn’t even know such sleazy hooker palaces existed in Bangkok and she had lived there for years. Many like her in Thailand. Yet, Coconut Farang, AWM, and their cohorts always know exactly where to find hookers. And these same schmucks will then insist that hookers are all over the damn place. Well maybe if you wouldn’t keep going looking for them, you might not find them!

I especially like this little quote from the AWM: “That's right, Khun Farangs female selection back home is so limited that Khun Farang drops his pants and heart to the first, second or tenth exotic Asian bar seat warming princess he sees.” Is there a huge shortage of farang females in America that I don’t know about? Have they been killing little girl babies for the last couple of decades? Wish there were some American women out there willing to shed light on this. My math may be a little off, but I think roughly half the folks in America are women. Or are all farang women bad too? Keep thinking like that and you’re going to run out of countries. Coconut farang says he’s in Singapore now. And if that doesn’t work out, he’s going to run the tables in other Asian countries because, gosh darn it, there’s got to be an Asian woman out there who needs and wants to be saved!

Coconut farang did perplex me a bit with the Singapore thing. I mean, I’ve been to Singapore. I can’t tell the difference between a Thai and a Singaporean and I’m Thai! They all thought I was Singaporean. Also lots of Indonesians and Malaysians there. Can’t tell them apart from the Thais either. So Singaporeans think all Thais are hookers, which is to say they think all Asian women there are hookers because you really can’t tell them apart? Unless…is there a farang/Thai hooker issue over there too? Just wondering what the heck you’re talking about. Doesn’t really matter though, because if Asians were in the US, a Singaporean is just the same as a Thai…and a Korean…and a Filipino….and a Chinese, and…well, you get the picture. When I tell most Americans that I’m Thai, they think I’m from Taiwan. Go figure.

I would offer one question to Khun Coconut farang and Kun Angry White Man and I hope they can grasp what I’m asking. I can see pretty much where they stand with respect to Thai people and I assume it’s based upon the Thai folks they’ve met, men and women. Now there are a whole lot of farangs that I know in Thailand, from all walks of life, from Bangkok to Chiang Mai, married to Thais and other farangs, and a good bunch of them are pretty well adjusted to the Thai lifestyle. (Mr. Stickman is a good example) More importantly, they have many Thai friends and acquaintances whom they deeply admire, and dare I say, are like family. Talk to these farangs and they’ll say that the Thais that they know are generally intelligent, honest, well-spoken, generous, and in a word (well a few words), some of the greatest people they’ve ever known. I just attended a going away party for such a guy a few weeks back and he said those very same things and much, much more. That’s quite a startling contrast from you boys. Which begs the question, why is that? Have they been led astray by the evil, manipulating Thais? Do they simply “don’t get it” the way you guys do? Or are they smarter than you? Adapt better than you? Treat people better? Or is it like the old saying, “birds of a feather, flock together.” You guys have only known Thais of questionable moral character and limited intelligence because maybe those are your Thai equivalents, your “counterparts” so to speak? I’d really like to know how so many farangs can have such different opinions of Thai people than you guys, i.e., he who knows so much about how Thai folks think and behave (note heavy sarcasm).

Mr. Stickman, you’re exactly right when you say that “…the Thais understand Thai society better than farangs…“ But there will be farangs who will never believe that. Because it’s easier, and much more empowering, to believe that Thai and Thai society is screwed up rather than to fess up to their own deficiencies and shortcomings. They have nothing new to offer, really. AWM’s advice to all farangs: “Hoe into these unwanted Thai women.” Just nail everything that moves, basically. I don’t think most farangs are looking for that. By “most” I mean the farangs living here that wants to be here and wants to find that one woman to share his life with. Some of them are just looking in the wrong places and they’re buying into this “cultural differences” thing that, although is there, is not really as pronounced as some would lead them to believe. Tear that huge language barrier down and what you’ll find is a woman that has more in common with women the world over than differences. I’d like to share a little more about typical Thai women—my favorite subject—but I think I wrote a little too much already. I just love them to death. Maybe another time.


Stickman's thoughts:

Great stuff. I LOVED your comments about black skin being an issue of beauty, and not racism. So right.

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