Stickman Readers' Submissions August 4th, 2010

Bargirls, Relationships Et Al

Excellent column this week! I think your guidelines for marrying a bargirl really hit the nail on the head, and in fact most of them could be applied to Thai women who are not in the industry, as well. How many non-bargirl marriages have you seen fail
because they violated one or more of your guidelines? Quite a few, I would expect.

I do know one man who has actually maintained a successful, not married though, relationship with a former bargirl over the last 3 years and he fits into your guidelines very well. He also did not "fall in love", he was actively seeking a bargirl
to become a live in girlfriend, he is in his seventies and the bar scene is not really his thing anymore. His plan, as laid out to me 3.5 years ago, was:

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* Beer bars only, no gogo girls as he thought they were too high maintenance and would probably want a larger monthly stipend than he was willing to pay. He knew that some stipend was going to be involved with any bargirl, just the amount was going to

* No woman under 30, again too high maintenance and likely to be getting some action on the side. His main concern was actually STDs as he was going to have his eventual choice tested for any irregularities and he could then forgo condoms
as he had a vasectomy years ago so he was not worried about pregnancy.

* No 8's, 9's or 10's on the looks scale, again, probably too high maintenance and expensive.

* No children, he doesn't like stretch marks and he figured that a woman with a child would want more money and that demands for $$ over and above the monthly allowance would be forthcoming.

With these guidelines, much the same as yours, he began his search. He speaks decent Thai, and that made his search much easier. He went to different beer bars and if he found a girl he liked he would barfine her LT a few times to see if they were compatible
sexually and if he liked her personality. If not, he would move on. After about 3 months he found a woman who fit the bill, 36, no kids and a 6 or 7 on the looks scale (although I give her body a solid 8). With the help of a friend, who speaks
fluent Thai, he sat her down and explained that he wanted her to be his live-in girlfriend and that he would treat her as a girlfriend should be treated, fairly and respectfully. However, he then explained that there were going to be some rules
that she would have to follow:

1) He would give her a monthly allowance of 10K baht per month, that she could with as she pleases, send it to her parents, go shopping, burn it, whatever she wanted to do with it was totally up to her. He also assured her that he would pay all the bills
and that if they went out together to eat or for entertainment that he would always pay.

2) No other sexual partners, period, and that he would be having her tested for STDs. He also explained that he didn't want anymore children and that he couldn't have any, anyway. I am not sure, but I think my friend mentioned that she cannot
have children as well.

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3) Do not ask for extra money. If there is some sort of emergency she may ask, but he will determine if he will help out or not. I believe he has helped out on occasion, usually if one of her parents is ill, but not a lot of baht.

4) Out of respect to her parents, he would like to send them each a gift on their respective birthdays every year. I think he sends them 5K baht on their birthdays, which I believe is more than their monthly income.

He then went on to explain to her that if she had problems or concerns about their relationship that she should come and talk to him about them as he would do with her. He told her that if they had too many problems and couldn't fix them that he
would ask to her leave and that she was free to leave, if she was unhappy, at any time as well. In the event that they did split, she would have to pack a bag and leave that day and go to her sister's home, she could come back later, when
he was there to get the rest of her things. The wily old fox has a padlock on the door, which is not normally used, to which he has the only key!

If they did split up, he told her that he would continue her allowance for three months, so she would have time to find work and a place to live. There are some other things they discussed, but I think you get the idea. Some might feel my friend is a
heartless bastard. I assure you he is not. He treats his girlfriend very well and I have to say that there is a genuine affection between them and they seem happy together. I believe he has actually made some small provisions in his will for her
as long as they are still together when he passes on. His girlfriend, obviously, does not know about this and won't until he is gone, but he has made it perfectly clear to his heirs and the executor of his estate that she should receive her
money. However, after reading about how your Phuket friend's possessions were stolen after his death, I think I will pass on that tidbit to him as an FYI.

One of the things that came to mind whilst reading your column was your comment about expats never asking another guy where they met their wives. It made me think of the expat forums which I am sure you are familiar with. There are a handful of guys who
post there, that freely admit that their wives or girlfriends were bargirls, but the vast majority claim that their wives all come from the middle to upper middle classes, college educated, etc. There is a running joke on some forums that all
married guys on the forums are married to Hi-So, Thai-Chinese women from rich and powerful families! Sure, if I was with a bargirl I wouldn't run around advertising it and to be honest I doubt that a lot of the men are with bargirls, although
I might be wrong. My theory is that many of these guys feel that there is something embarrassing about their wives (or maybe how they met them, e.g. dating service, etc), whether it's their level of education, difference in their ages, maybe
there is a large socio-economic gap between husband and wife, etc. Whatever the reason, I think these guys are loathe to admit their wife's background as they may somehow feel that they may be perceived as marrying beneath themselves or be
ridiculed in some way. I might be wrong, but I just can't imagine that so many guys have married all these wonderful catches, I'm sure that some have but not as many that claim to have. Do you agree? If I am right though, I think it
does not bode well for the marriage if a man is ashamed or embarrassed of his wife's background.

I admire a guy like Sawasdee2000 who freely admits that his wife "grew up dirt poor" and who in fact seems quite proud of his wife's common sense and dare I say it, her frugality! I think that a guy could do a lot worse than marrying an
honest, hardworking Thai woman from a poor rural background, and many have. One final thought about the expat forum, many guys crow about how wonderful their wife is, and I certainly hope and believe that many of them are, yet they always seem
to leave out how long they have been married or if they have bought a piece of land and built a house in their wife's names yet. I am a cynic, yes, but I would guess that a number of these "wonderful wives" are playing the part
till they get exactly what they want and when they do the defecation is going to hit the rotary oscillator!

Case in point, a while back a guy started a thread about his upcoming marriage to a Thai girl and how exciting and wonderful it was, she is so loving and sweet, her family is poor but super nice and have never asked for money, where the wedding was going
to be, what the honeymoon plans were, blah, blah, blah, you get my drift. He was happier than a pig in shit and in fact roses were growing out of the shit! He got some cynical advice, of course, but blatantly ignored it and in fact heaped scorn
on some of the more, let us say, forthright posters, I was not one of them by the way. Stick, I know, you know where this example is headed, but even you might be surprised at the rapidity of it. In less than TWO WEEKS after his marriage, this
guy had started a new thread bemoaning the multiple demands for money for her family and that she wanted him to start thinking about land and a house, I couldn't believe it! I don't think this guy was a troll, as I messaged him privately
with some advice and some links to some of your green star submissions and we corresponded back and forth for awhile. His responses were just too detailed for me to believe that he was trolling and I do know of two other forum members who were
in touch with him. He finally asked me stop messaging him when I let slip that I get up to some mongering when I visit South East Asia, he basically told me that men who go with whores shouldn't be giving out marital advice, but not so nicely.
My final Korskiesque response to him was that my many and varied whores were costing me a lot less time, aggravation and money than his one whore was costing him!

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Stickman's thoughts:

This was originally sent to me as an email but I thought it was more than interesting enough to be a reader's story and the author agreed, hence it appears here.

What is said about guys saying their marriage is wonderful, yet are suffering all sorts of crap that they fail to mention is a VERY common amongst Westerners in Thailand. No bloke wants to admit he chose the wrong bird and is living a misery….

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