Sex And Religion – My View
I just finished reading Farangutan’s submission entitled Sex and Religion and I have to say he makes some very good points. There is one major flaw in his reasoning though. He’s forgetting that Japan is also a predominantly Buddhist country yet the women there are some of the best lovers on the planet. In fact, it sometimes seems as if they were bred specifically for the purpose of pleasing men. Of the 80 or so Japanese women that I’ve had the pleasure of having been with (no prostitutes) there were only one or two who I would say were less than enthusiastic partners. They are just all very passionate lovers. They make all the right sounds and facial expressions and basically put on a good show.
Speaking of which, I remember I was watching one of those silly late night Japanese TV shows once and they were discussing the different types of noises women make during sex. They had broken them down into 4 basic types, which they then wrote down, along with a description of each, on a big poster board sign. Next they took this sign around to busy parts of Tokyo asking girls on the street which type they thought they were. Even the sweetest most demure looking girls would just laugh, think for a second and then point to the type of sexual noises they thought most closely approximated their own.
Later on in the show they took some guy and hooked him up to a heart monitor, then had him listen to a porn star do her best rendition of each type of sound so they could see which one would get the biggest response. I don’t remember what the final outcome was but personally I go for the soft feminine squeaks and squeals myself rather than the gut wrenching moans and groans. I just can't concentrate on the task at hand when I’m worried that the neighbors might phone the police thinking someone is being murdered in my apartment (had some real screamers before).
Anyway, I used to really wonder just how it is that Japanese girls all got to be such passionate lovers. After all it can’t just be a natural instinct can it? And yet even virgins seemed to know how to make sex a satisfying experience. I would sometimes jokingly wonder if there weren’t some super secret sex school that all Japanese women were required to attend at an early age, unbeknownst to the male members of the society. They just seem to be so willing to please their partners. For instance I’d say at least 80% of the Japanese girls I’ve been with not only freely gave oral sex but were also very good at it. And there’s no running to the bathroom gagging and spitting, such as is the case with some Thai girls (if they will do it at all that is). By the way, how is it that these same Thai women seem to have no trouble eating fried roaches or crickets? Of course I have to admit if it was necessary for me to chew on one of those fried bugs to make my partner happy I would probably spit it out and make a big fuss as well. It’s just a psychological aversion on both our parts I guess.
Why Japanese girls don’t seem to mind oral sex is anybody’s guess. From living there though I know that sex is just considered a normal human function like eating or sleeping. This would tend to dispel the whole “guilt driven catholic girl equals hot sex” thing. I still think there’s something to that theory though.
Back to the problem at hand though, why exactly is it that Thai women don’t seem to be very passionate in bed? If we want to get to the bottom of this problem the first thing we have to do is acknowledge the fact that it has nothing to do with whether or not Thai women are actually able to experience sexual pleasure. As we all should know, most women in any country don’t have orgasms on a regular basis and according to recent surveys less than 20% of women are able to achieve orgasm during intercourse. For the other 80 to 90 percent orgasm can only be achieved by manual or oral stimulation. Even then most women don’t get there most of the time. Any guy who thinks he has “satisfied” most of his women most of the time is quite frankly a fool. The truth is we can never really know regardless of what we might think. I’ve only had one girlfriend who I can say without question had orgasms. This is because just as she climaxed her whole body would shudder and her ass would suddenly perspire when just a second earlier it was bone dry. There is no way to fake a muscular spasm similar to a shiver and there is no way to turn on sweat glands on command. In the absence of that kind of physical evidence though you can never know for sure regardless of what they might say.
Anyway, the point is women are putting on a show for us and as men we greatly appreciate this show because it’s an important component of the sexual experience. So the real question here is why Thai women don’t seem to be able or willing to put on this show for us, not whether or not they are able to enjoy sex. And of course since virtually all of the sexual experience’s relayed on this site have to do with prostitutes there is really no way to know if this problem affects all Thai women or just prostitutes. If I had to guess though I’d say that it’s mostly limited to prostitutes.
As for my own experience I can say that, besides the Thai love of my life, there have only been four Thai women I’ve been with who I would say were truly passionate lovers. One was a prostitute, one was a definite nice normal Thai girl, and two were borderline nice girls. By “borderline” I mean they had legitimate day jobs but it’s entirely possible that on occasion they might go to a disco, end up sleeping with a guy they like, and then accept money for it.
Anyway perhaps if we take a closer look at these four women we can find some common thread running through their lives which makes them such passionate lovers and thus learn why most others are not.
Ahhh, who am I kidding? I’m just looking for an excuse to tell another story.
Girl number one I met on my very first trip to Thailand in 1992 when I was still living in Japan. I was in Pattaya and it was the last two days of my vacation. I had never slept with a prostitute before in my life and had resisted the temptation so far on this trip. Anyway I saw this girl in Marine Disco and was instantly captivated by her beauty and sex appeal. She was about 5’-2”- 95lb’s, had a perfect body and a cute yet very seductive baby-doll face. She looked kind of like an Asian Pia Zadora, if you can imagine that. Her face was the quintessential blend of Chinese and Thai features – definitely not an Isaan girl. She also looked very high class and I imagined that wherever she worked must have been a very expensive high-class place. Her English was nearly perfect as well, which was a nice plus since it seemed most girls spoke little or no English back then.
I can’t remember how I first approached her but I remember everything after that. We first discussed price and I was pleasantly surprised that she was only asking the standard going rate for short time. Just the night before there was some high-class hooker there in the VIP section who all the staff were treating like royalty and when I questioned her about price she told me 3000 baht for short time and said she did not do long time – too rich for my blood.
Anyway as we left the disco she asked where my room was and I told her I wasn’t sure if over night guests were allowed there. The truth is I didn’t want to take her back there anyway. I felt ashamed to be seen with a prostitute and I didn’t want the hotel staff to think I was a sex-tourist (obviously I’ve gotten over that). She said we could go to her place, which was just a 5-minute walk away.
As we walked I noticed that this girl really loved to talk about herself. First she told me all about her family and their various jobs and how well they were all doing – apparently she was the black sheep of the family. She also mentioned how her family had been in Bangkok for many, many generations, a fact which she seemed to be very proud of. Then she started bragging about all the extremely wealthy guys she knew from various countries who all wanted to marry her and who, apparently were all sending her ridiculous amounts of money every month. I didn’t doubt it for a second. I could see how she could have an almost hypnotic affect on men and how easy it would be to get sucked in. Unlike the bargirls I usually meet today though this girl never pretended to be anything other that what she was – a companion with a price tag. She was the most confident and self-assured 20 year old I’d ever met and I liked that about her. This was a girl who lived life on her own terms and made no excuses about it. She did what she liked and if you didn’t like it, too bad.
I knew that it wasn’t really about the money for her though. Hell, she already had more money than she knew what to do with and her family wasn’t exactly hurting for money either. No… she chose this line of work because of the sense of control it gave her over men. I’m sure she got an almost sadistic thrill out of the fact that she could treat all her “boyfriends” like door mats and they would just keep coming back for more. They were like pathetic puppets and she was the puppet master pulling all the strings. I’m sure she never said she loved them or made any pretense to being anything other than their paid companion and yet they still all thought they loved her and that they could change her. The sad fact is though that even if this girl were to marry a millionaire there’s not much doubt that she would eventually start prostituting herself again. She needs that sense of power and control it gives her. Obviously there was some traumatic event in her life involving a male she cared for; perhaps she was even molested at an early age – who knows. Anyway at some point a switch just went off in her head and she decided that she would always be in control of men from now on. Educated girls from good families don’t just wake up one day and decide they want to be prostitutes.
Anyway, we eventually arrived at her place. When we got up to her room the first thing she did was ask me if I wanted to watch a porno. She then pointed out her extensive collection of porno videos, which seemed to be mostly from the USA. I said I didn’t
really care and she put one in the VCR and hit the play button. I’ve never really cared much for porn and I especially didn’t need it now when I had the real thing right in front of me.
Then she told me to “get comfortable’ and she went into the restroom. When she came out she was wearing this sexy pink see through negligée. MY GOD SHE LOOKED HOT IN THAT THING! I could see her bare breast through the mesh material and they were perfectly shaped and even larger than I had originally thought. She had perfect skin as well. It was a golden tan color but not dark at all.
Anyway, before we started I told her I had to go to the bathroom. I noticed earlier that there was no doorknob on the bathroom door and that the hole where the knob used to be was covered with a piece of plywood. I didn’t really think much of it though until right after I closed the door behind me and I heard her yell out “NO, don’t close the door all the way!” It was too late. Apparently although the doorknob was missing, the latch was still in place. Now there was no way to open the door from either side and I was trapped. I couldn’t believe it! The hottest girl on the planet was just on the other side of that door, ready to give me the best sex of my life and I’m locked in the goddamn toilet! To make matters worse it was getting extremely hot in there and, although I didn’t want to have to resort to breaking down the door, I didn’t know how long I could stand it. I also panicked for a second when I realized that my pants and wallet were on the other side of the door with her. But then I thought “where’s she going to go with my wallet, we’re in her apartment after all”.
Eventually I got her to pass me a kitchen knife under the door and I slid it in the door jam trying to snag the bolt. After a while though I realized this was not going to work and that I would have to pry the wood covering off the hole and access it from the inside. It wasn’t easy because it was glued on but eventually I broke it off. Now we could see each other through the hole at least which made me feel better and less claustrophobic. Anyway now that I had access to the internal part of the mechanism it didn’t take long to get out. Finally I was out of my cell after 30 long minutes of captivity.
We had a good laugh about my predicament and then it was time to get down to business.
I really wanted to kiss her but I had always heard that prostitutes don’t kiss customers. I didn’t know at the time that in Thailand it was okay with most of them. She asked if I’d like to undress her but I said she could do it. I can’t even begin to find the words to describe how incredible her body looked as she stood there naked in front of me. She was a living breathing work of art. Anyway I laid her down on the bed and just got right to it as I figured a prostitute would not want me to engage in foreplay. As soon as I was inside her she stated making the most heavenly erotic moans I’ve ever heard in my life. Every thing was perfect, the way her body looked, the way her skin felt, the way she smelled, the sounds she was making. Even the way she felt inside was shear perfection and I felt more stimulated down there than I ever had been in my life. It was as if she had been genetically engineered to meet my specific sexual needs. Well it was all too much and I’m embarrassed to say that within a mere 15 to 20 seconds I was ready to explode inside of her. Realizing this I quickly pulled out to change positions hoping that the time in between would settle me down a bit. I positioned her on her hands and knees and entered her from behind. It didn’t help though; I only lasted another 10 seconds before it was all over. I’ve never exactly been know for being quick on the trigger, in fact usually quite the opposite, but I just couldn’t help it with her.
Anyway as I came inside her she let out a long “Ahhhhhhhhhhh” in a sarcastic tone which made it clear that she was trying to make me feel bad about finishing so quickly. Then some time later while we were talking, out of the blue, she suddenly started making those same sounds she was making during sex earlier. She obviously wanted to make me feel bad by showing me that it had all been an act. As I said before this girl clearly had issues with men and she seemed to be an expert at deflating the fragile male ego. I just smiled and laughed it off though. I was determined not to let her find a chink in my armor. You see for some reason I wanted her to like me and I knew that with this particular type of personality the best way to do that would be to act as if I couldn’t care less about her. These types of girls are used to having guys instantly fall in love with them. When a guy comes along though who treats them like they’re just another of many girls and nothing special they often find themselves strangely drawn to him. I was basically just turning the tables on her and trying to use her own game on her. I’ve never done this before or since though as I like to just be myself with people and I have no idea why I did it then. I have to admit though I gave an academy award winning performance and she never had a clue that I was actually totally smitten by her.
Eventually we went out to eat breakfast at about 4am. We went to one of those little stands in the street and since there where no menus I told her to order for me. I don’t remember what I got but I remember it was spicy as hell. I’m surprised it didn’t burn a hole right through my stomach. After we ate I told her I need to sleep and we went our separate ways.
The next night she arrived at the disco at her usual time, around 3AM. I saw her come in but I decided I would let her come to me. Five or ten minutes later she found me sitting on a bench and she sat down next to me and said hello. We both sat there silent for a while looking bored as we staring blankly at the crowd. Then she turned to me a said “So, are you gonna take me home?” I couldn’t believe it! My “I couldn’t care less about you” routine was actually working. This is a girl who definitely doesn’t need do ask a guy to go with her. Almost any guy would pay any amount to be with her.
It was a bittersweet victory however. It was the last day of my trip and I was almost broke. In 92 it wasn’t quite as easy as it is today to get cash in the middle of the night with an ATM card from another country. My Japanese ATM card was pretty much useless at 3AM in Pattaya. I couldn’t just give her the last of my cash and it was much too early in our “relationship” for me to be telling her I’ll pay her later. I didn’t want to tell her about my temporary lack of funds though so I just told her I didn’t feel like it tonight. We hung out and talked for about 30 minutes and then I went back to my room to sleep. I’m still kicking myself today for not taking enough cash with me on that trip. I could have taken her for the whole night this time and really done it right. That could have been the most amazing night of my life. After that I swore to everything holy that I would NEVER again let myself get caught without sufficient funds in Thailand.
The next day I went back to my life in Tokyo and I never saw her again. Sometimes I wish I would have had more time with her but I know eventually she would have got the better of me and I would have got sucked in like all those other guys. After all she been playing this game of hers a lot longer than me and whatever control I though I was gaining over her would have been very short lived indeed. Yep, she would have chewed me up and spit me out, no doubt about it.
This girl obviously would have been a nightmare as a girlfriend but you have to admit she’s got to be just about the ideal prostitute. She’s better in bed than a porn star, fun to be with, and she’ll never give you a sob story or
some bullshit about being in love with you. Just cash for great sex. Isn’t that how it’s supposed to be after all?
Girl number two was a nice normal (well not really so normal) high school student from Bangkok. Unfortunately I can’t tell her story here because I don’t want to divulge any details that might give away who she is. If she ever found out I was writing about her on here she would catch the next flight to the States, purchase a handgun, then hunt me down and put a bullet through my brain. Personally I’d like to live long enough to write a few more stories. For the purposes of this discussion though I can tell you that she was one of the most passionate lovers I’ve ever had and she was certainly the most sensitive to touch. She was very orgasmic and seemed to be in ecstasy during sex. Also she gave the best oral sex I’ve ever received from a Thai girl. Despite her age she was fairly experienced having had two European boyfriends in the past. (Damn Europeans – always getting there first)
Girl number three was an office worker from Bangkok. We first met in Pattaya where she was visiting for the weekend. I was in Lucifer’s when I first noticed her. The first thing I usually notice on a girl is her ass and hers definitely didn’t disappoint. It was as round and firm as they come and she had a very tiny waist as well (No flat butts or narrow hips for me thank you). She smiled at me a few times but we didn’t end up talking until later when I ran into her again at Marine Disco at about 2:30AM <at Marine Disco, yes, definitely an office worker…. – Stick> She came up to me at the bar and started talking. I really wasn’t feeling well that night though and I just wasn’t in the mood for the typical bargirl bullshit. So I turned to her and said. “Look! If you want to stand here and talk that’s fine but I don’t feel good and I have no intention of taking anyone home tonight”. She gave me bright perky smile and said “That’s fine, I just want to talk too”. Now I had had bar girls try to pull this stunt on me before but something about the way she spoke and acted just put me at ease. She just didn’t talk like a bargirl. She definitely did like to talk though. In fact I could hardly get a word in edgewise. She told all about her life and her family and her job and about her baby girls. She was a very proud mom. Anyway, we ended up back at my place and talked a while and then we both got undressed and went to sleep on our separate sides of the bed. I was so tired that night that sex was the last thing on my mind and I fell asleep very quickly.
As you might have guessed though sometime during the night we ended up in the middle of the bed together and just started having sex. I’ve always liked those spontaneous middle of the night sex sessions – you’re half awake still dreaming and you just roll over and suddenly you’re inside her. Anyway she was very passionate and seemed to really enjoy it. I remember how refreshing this felt after all the meaningless mechanical bargirl sex I’d been having recently. We had sex two more times that morning and I can’t forget how amazing her body looked when I was doing her from behind, looking down at that incredibly tiny waist and that round firm ass.
Eventually we had to get out of bed though because she had to return to Bangkok I was very apprehensive before she left because I didn’t know what to do about the money situation. I didn’t want to risk offending her by offering her money if she was really a normal girl and had just slept with me because she wanted to. On the other hand if she was expecting money………
I finally decided that if she slept with me on the first night then it was a safe bet that she’s done this sort of thing before, and if so the guy would have surely offered her money. She had to be expecting it. Anyway, when she was about to leave
I handed her the normal 1000B. At first she looked surprised, then she quickly smiled and said in a bright cheery voice “for my babies?” and then she thanked me. This was quick thinking on her part I though and it avoided an awkward
situation. Now she could accept the money without giving the appearance that she was being paid for sex. I’m sure now that she wouldn’t have thought twice about it if I hadn’t offered her money but I’m glad she took
Later that week she told me she got the day off and she wanted to come to Pattaya to see me that night. She had to work the next day though and it just seemed silly to come all that way just for one night and I told her so. She came to see me off at the airport in Bangkok though which was nice of her. I was having a really bad day then because the day before I realized that I had lost my ATM card and my bank told me there was no way to get a new one to me there. Also I still had four days of vacation left in another country before going home. She offered to give me some money but I told her I would be fine.
After I returned home we talked on the phone often but then one day I called her up and she was crying. I could hear a young Thai mans voice yelling in the background. He must have been her ex-husband and the father of her children. She sounded to be in very bad shape and I was very worried about her but she wouldn’t tell me what was going on. The next time I tried to call her phone was disconnected and I somehow misplaced her office number. I guess I’ll never know what happened but I hope she is okay.
Girl number four I still keep in touch with so once again I cant really give any details about how we met. She has a regular job in Pattaya and I’m 99% sure she has never accepted money for sex. On the other hand she has told me that she’s often propositioned by men and I can tell that she’s actually considered doing it. I guess it’s not that uncommon for department store girls and the like to have men offer them money for sex and some of these girls eventually succumb to the lure of easy money. Apparently these guys think every girl has her price. Anyway this girl too was a passionate lover but that’s all I can say about it.
So what have we learned from all this? Well, the only thing I can see these women have in common is that the first three are from well-established Bangkok families and the fourth’s family is not far from Bangkok. Perhaps it’s just country girls who are not passionate lovers. Perhaps Bangkok girls learn about sex from talking with their classmates in school. Perhaps they’re more exposed to sexual images and information in the media. Who knows? One thing’s for sure – we need more data on non-prostitutes to really get a handle on this thing.
That information probably won’t be coming from me though. You see, although I’ve gone out with a lot of strictly nice normal Thai girls in Bangkok I’ve always managed to avoid having sex with them. It’s not that I didn’t want to have sex with them because I did. Its just that once I detect how emotionally fragile the are underneath I don’t want to be responsible for the mental and emotional meltdown that would surely occur should things not work out between us.
In America or Japan girls understand that dating is the process of getting to know if two people are compatible and they realize that sex is an important part of this process. They also know it takes more that one date to know if you’re compatible, and if things don’t work out after a few dates both parties can just move on.
Thai women on the other hand seem to think you are their boy friend after one date, even if there’s no sex involved <only the crazy ones think like this – Stick>. Can you imagine if I had sex with one of these girls who’s never even kissed a boy in her life and can't even meet me the first time without bringing a friend along? She would be absolutely devastated if it didn’t work out. And I would be an ass hole of course.
Thai girls also don’t seem to understand that if a guy is only in their country for a few weeks a year he wants to see as many women as possible to give him the best chance of finding the right one. If one of these same girls however were only allowed to shop for clothes once a year and could only buy one thing you can bet your ass she’d try on every outfit in the whole store, some three or four times. She would do this because she understands that what looks good on the rack won’t necessarily look good on her or even fit right. So WHY can’t Thai women understand that this same concept applies to dating? Even bargirls don’t seem to be able to grasp this concept, or should I say especially bar girls?
Anyway this is why I’ve avoided a lot of sexual encounters with normal Thai women up to now.
There was one girl whom I wouldn’t have hesitated sleeping with for a second though. This girl was definite marriage material. Unfortunately though her interest in me was limited to friendship. Her first lover and boyfriend was some European guy (see what I mean!) who was living in Bangkok at the time and she never really stopped loving him after they broke up. She was a beautiful girl and she could have easily got work in modeling. She had exactly the kind of face that Bangkok modeling agencies and advertisers would kill for. Her life long dream was to become a flight attendant though and about a year after we first met that dream came true for her. She now works as a flight attendant for a major international carrier, which I will not name here.
Anyway I hope I’ll continue to do the right thing and not sleep with these women unless I think there is at least a reasonable chance it will lead to something serious. On the other hand I am just a guy and like most guys I’m pretty much at the mercy of my hormones most of the time.
Well here we are 5000 words later and still no closer to answering the central question of this piece then when we started. I guess I’ll have to leave that to someone else. Still it was nice to take a stroll down memory lane and revisit the good old days. And hopefully some of you enjoyed ride as well.
The second to last paragraph…..there is NO need to feel guilty!